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evileI wish I was better with 2nd chances, both giving and receiving of them... but I usually just put up with whatever unpleasantness until it finally scrapes my last nerve raw, then *kaboom*, everything is all over with, forever. I don't necessarily like that about myself.
A lot of times it seems people are genuinely surprised and shocked when I finally lose my shit. It's like they've been standing on my toes for 10 years and I finally yell "HEY GET OFF MY TOES!"...so, really, my fault for not recognizing that I'm being violated as soon as it happens the first time and enforcing the boundary politely and calmly the very first time it's violated.
Instead, I let things slide too far and by the time I finally do say something, I'm too angry and in pain to create a situation where we can talk things thru and come to an understanding. it's like...10 years of stomping on me is enough, fuck off. And they may not have realized that they were stomping, they may not have realized I was not OK with stomping, hell, they might have even thought I liked the stomping. So it's not entirely other peoples' fault when this kind of thing eventually goes down.
in more specific examples,
J Law and I had a disagreement in college over something dumb that I don't even remember. We didn't speak until, like, a year later, we both signed up for the same fitness class, and since we were pretty much the only women in the class, and at a similar fitness level, we got partnered up, and eventually started talking again and have maintained our friendship ever since.
there's X. She and I had a falling-out when we were teenagers that we eventually got over (after awhile of not speaking)...but then when we were 34, there was a huge falling out, which left me emotionally devastated and still riddled with bugaboos. So maybe we should have just left it at the verbal/physical slap match at age 17 and not gotten back together after that.
There's my ex. I let things slide with him for a long time, but eventually when he was rude to my stepdad, that was enough, and there were no more second/third/300th chances. OTOH, he did not ever care when I told him what was wrong, what I needed, what I wanted him to do, why I was upset with him, etc. so there was never a situation with him where I said "you did this and it offended me" and he said "Oh, I was not intending to offend you," and we tried again...It was just like I got tired of speaking to a brick wall. All the 2nd chances were internal and he didn't give a shit.
There's my stepbrother, sineater, who takes offense to something I say or do, lets me have it and then gives me the silent treatment until something happens to put us in the same place at the same time. We can manage politeness but I don't think there will ever be more to it than that. He doesn't want to listen to me and apparently I don't want to listen to him, either (mostly because I don't really care to hear what an awful person I am and how everything is all my fault)...so that'll never get fixed. But I'd still be willing to try, if he ever was.
There's my brother A, who at The Rubber Pig's urging/brainwashing, disowned the entire family. Kicked me out of his life with a nasty phone answering machine message that said a bunch of ugly things and bla bla. I doubt we'd have reconciled if he'd stayed with her; but him being locked away from her, and me only able to write to him at first...I was able to write everything out, and he was able to write back and now we are pretty solid.
For me, I guess family gets infinite chances, and they can beat me up as much as they want and I'll come crawling back for more abuse as soon as they indicate that they're willing to speak to me again, and I'm not allowed to have preferences or opinions that are different than theirs, because if I do, then I'm a bad person, and I get beat up and excluded again.
Friends I can be more discriminating, and in general, once I kick a friend to the curb, or a friend kicks me to the curb, that's pretty much it, with the exception of J-Law.
I guess the important thing with J Law is that we actually TALKED, and demonstrated to each other that we were willing to try harder and do better and grow the hell up. So if that could happen with me and anyone, it could probably end up as a 2nd chance. But if all someone wants is the gravy train, a punching bag, a wallet, or an emotional dump heap, I can only deal with that for so long, and then I don't allow it anymore.
A lot of times it seems people are genuinely surprised and shocked when I finally lose my shit. It's like they've been standing on my toes for 10 years and I finally yell "HEY GET OFF MY TOES!"...so, really, my fault for not recognizing that I'm being violated as soon as it happens the first time and enforcing the boundary politely and calmly the very first time it's violated.
Instead, I let things slide too far and by the time I finally do say something, I'm too angry and in pain to create a situation where we can talk things thru and come to an understanding. it's like...10 years of stomping on me is enough, fuck off. And they may not have realized that they were stomping, they may not have realized I was not OK with stomping, hell, they might have even thought I liked the stomping. So it's not entirely other peoples' fault when this kind of thing eventually goes down.
in more specific examples,
J Law and I had a disagreement in college over something dumb that I don't even remember. We didn't speak until, like, a year later, we both signed up for the same fitness class, and since we were pretty much the only women in the class, and at a similar fitness level, we got partnered up, and eventually started talking again and have maintained our friendship ever since.
there's X. She and I had a falling-out when we were teenagers that we eventually got over (after awhile of not speaking)...but then when we were 34, there was a huge falling out, which left me emotionally devastated and still riddled with bugaboos. So maybe we should have just left it at the verbal/physical slap match at age 17 and not gotten back together after that.
There's my ex. I let things slide with him for a long time, but eventually when he was rude to my stepdad, that was enough, and there were no more second/third/300th chances. OTOH, he did not ever care when I told him what was wrong, what I needed, what I wanted him to do, why I was upset with him, etc. so there was never a situation with him where I said "you did this and it offended me" and he said "Oh, I was not intending to offend you," and we tried again...It was just like I got tired of speaking to a brick wall. All the 2nd chances were internal and he didn't give a shit.
There's my stepbrother, sineater, who takes offense to something I say or do, lets me have it and then gives me the silent treatment until something happens to put us in the same place at the same time. We can manage politeness but I don't think there will ever be more to it than that. He doesn't want to listen to me and apparently I don't want to listen to him, either (mostly because I don't really care to hear what an awful person I am and how everything is all my fault)...so that'll never get fixed. But I'd still be willing to try, if he ever was.
There's my brother A, who at The Rubber Pig's urging/brainwashing, disowned the entire family. Kicked me out of his life with a nasty phone answering machine message that said a bunch of ugly things and bla bla. I doubt we'd have reconciled if he'd stayed with her; but him being locked away from her, and me only able to write to him at first...I was able to write everything out, and he was able to write back and now we are pretty solid.
For me, I guess family gets infinite chances, and they can beat me up as much as they want and I'll come crawling back for more abuse as soon as they indicate that they're willing to speak to me again, and I'm not allowed to have preferences or opinions that are different than theirs, because if I do, then I'm a bad person, and I get beat up and excluded again.
Friends I can be more discriminating, and in general, once I kick a friend to the curb, or a friend kicks me to the curb, that's pretty much it, with the exception of J-Law.
I guess the important thing with J Law is that we actually TALKED, and demonstrated to each other that we were willing to try harder and do better and grow the hell up. So if that could happen with me and anyone, it could probably end up as a 2nd chance. But if all someone wants is the gravy train, a punching bag, a wallet, or an emotional dump heap, I can only deal with that for so long, and then I don't allow it anymore.
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no subject
Date: 2010-08-07 09:29 pm (UTC)The hard part seems to be discerning between the people who are truly doing this by accident and the people who are recklessly or intentionally hurting us (then saying it is an "accident" or blaming us as the problem). The former deserves xtra chances, but we need to protect ourselves from the latter.
Sigh.
Hugs.
no subject
Date: 2010-08-07 11:32 pm (UTC)*shrug* I think there are mostly just people who are doing what they want to do, and don't really care if it hurts or offends me, or anyone else. And my choice[?] to become offended is not their fault or their problem...
I just don't think there's anyone out there who does things on purpose to offend me, that would be a wierd kind of backwards narcissism at work to think that. There are people out there who dislike me and tell wierd lies about me in order to ...what? justify their dislike? make others dislike me, too? make themselves look good? I don't know. But all of that is not really my problem....honestly, I'm not sure what, if anything, I have the right to ask or demand of others, as far as 'boundaries' or giving/taking offense. That whole thingk about 'nobody can make me feel inferior without my permission'...does it also extend to 'nobody can hurt my feelings or offend me unless I choose to be hurt or offended by them'? "you are responsible for your own experience" The more I think about it, the less sense it all makes. Just seems like everyone's allowed to be an asshole and I can stand here and take it or I can leave, and there's not a valid choice that involves attempting to change anyone but me.
no subject
Date: 2010-08-08 05:11 pm (UTC)(I don't generally unfriend people or totally dump friends in a dramatic way -- but if someone is doing stuff that is, for me, crazymaking, I back off on the closeness. Someone I held next to my heart, I'm holding at arm's length now. But I still care about that person, just don't want to be around enough to be made crazy again. Internet tools help me a lot with that one. OTOH, if it weren't for the internet stuff in the first place, I could have just drifted apart and let the relationship die in oblivion. At least evite tells me what the odds are of my meeting that person at someone's party....)