Graaaaargh!

[evile]

longshot14 posted some links that he finds interesting and useful. I checked this one out, since clutter is a constant foe at my house. The top article pushed my buttons like ... a crazy amount. Wow, I can't believe it still pisses me off so much!

I hate to be one of those people who starts a sentence with "My therapist said"...but I gotta take exception to the last part of #3: "Discuss the real problem. If you’re upset that your wife repeatedly leaves her dirty dishes strewn about the living room your frustration has very little to do with dirty dishes. You’re upset because you believe she doesn’t care about the cleanliness level in the living space. So, talk about the real problem and use the dirty dishes as an example of how that lack of caring is expressed."

See, to *me* dirty socks on the coffee table meant "I don't care about this house and I don't care about you. I have no respect for the home we bought together or the household we've made together."

(which, as it turns out, was true. But his slobbyness was not relevant to that fact.)

HOWEVER, according to my REBT therapist, his messyness didn't MEAN anything to my partner, one way or the other. There was no 'underlying issue' in his mind. The coffee table was just a handy place to stash socks when he came home from work. The problem was not his action or his behavior, it was my assumptions and my emotional response to his actions/behavior.

So, step one is not to get to the underlying issue. It's to own your feelings about the behavior, not blame him for the feelings. THEN address the behavior, not your emotional response to the behavior.

And never EVER EVER EVER EVER assume that you know what someone is thinking or feeling because of how they're behaving. You may be right, you may be wrong.

The point is not to assume, but to ASK.

(I still don't have ANY clue how to live happily with someone if your ideas of cleanliness are completely different. My solution was to keep the house and dump the mess-maker. And now that it's MY house, I'm afraid I've become somewhat autocratic in how I keep it. My house, my rules, you don't like it, bye-bye.

Possibly not the best solution, but one I am currently pretty happy with.)

Comments

[red-tanya.livejournal.com]

well, getting to the underlying issue, that he had no respect for you or the house (and I'm guessing himself), would have served a purpose, but it wouldn't necessarily have helped the house look nicer... actually, it would. Because it would result in him not being in it, so mess problem SOLVED! yay.

I'm in a mood today; sorry if I've overstepped.

[bramblekite.livejournal.com]

Well, in one way, I suppose you're right, but look at from another way....how would YOU like it if every time you did (or didn't) do something your partner wanted done, it got turned into "You didn't make biscuits for supper, that means you don't love me, WAAAAAH!"

"You left your socks on the coffee table AGAIN, that means you don't respect me as a person, oh boooohooooo!"

fuck that, dude. SEriously. That is what is called "womany bullshit"

ASK for what you want or need.

If necessary, say how someone's actions, inactions, or behaviors make you feel. NOT that "you made me feel that way, and it's all your fault, you bastard!" but "When you leave socks on the coffee table, it makes me feel you don't respect me or our home."

THEN, if the person persists in continuing to engage in behavior or inaction that you have let be known is offensive, THEN you have a problem, and a situation in which it's quite likely they don't respect you, don't care what you think, feel, or want, and it's time to part ways. One incident is not a deal breaker. A continued pattern of behavior IS.

And it is up to YOU to let it be known what you want, and perhaps why you want it and what their behavior indicates to you of their feelings, and what their behavior leads you to think and feel.

[bramblekite.livejournal.com]

Or maybe simplify to: everything is not about YOU.

Sometimes the other person just does something because it's the easiest thing for them to do.

No underlying issue, no emotional motivation, just 'damn, I've had a long day, time to take off shoes,"

If you then decide to take it personally and make a big emotional mess about it, rather than state simply and calmly what is needed...it becomes "An Issue".

But everything doesn't have to be "An Issue"

[red-tanya.livejournal.com]

everything doesn't have to be "An Issue"

amen to that!

[red-tanya.livejournal.com]

agreed, whining is NOT encouraged. The "when you... I feel.." sentences are better, but I think that the correct response from a caring partner to that is, "let's figure out what we can do to fix that", not "yeah, whatever." But then again... I'm in a mood...